Dear Welder Series…
I recently came across your MII installation instructions, and I am really impressed. A great tool for a builder!
I have few questions; (The more I study it the more I have questions!)
1. Am I correct in saying that your instructions will only establish the desired ride height, if on assembly, the lower control arm is positioned as you assumed it would be when you wrote the instructions? What position does the lower control arm need to be in? (The old method of placing a straight edge under the cross member and the control arm resting on it?)
2. I see on your web site you answer questions about maximum outside frame width to avoid frame notching to clear coil springs. You point out that the maximum varies depending on ride height… understood.
I am looking at installation of an MII in a 1934 Chrysler which will need the frame narrowed considerably because it “flares” out to 36 inches- outside width (the existing frame runs to the outside of the existing coils spring.) I am looking at narrowing the “flare” to 29-1/2” (outside) to match the existing frame dimension on the firewall side of the “flare”. I would like to narrow the frame sufficiently to avoid any frame notching for spring clearance. I am not building the car to be super low… a car that will allow me to roll a floor jack under the cross member.
Will 29-1/2” be a fairly safe number to avoid frame notching for MII coil springs on a 56”or 58” system?
3. If the frame dimensions and the cross member dimensions are such that the cross member gets welded to the underside of the frame and the OUTSIDE of the frame, doesn’t the section of the cross member outside the frame interfere with the springs?
4. I see you recommend longer tie rod ends for the 58” system. Does this not create bump steer because it changes the relationship of the hinge points of the control arms relative to the tie rod hinge point?
5. The Internet tells me that the tubular lower A arms are failing where they extend to the rear of the cross member. Do you have experience with this issue?
Thanks in advance for your help.
Keith
Dear Keith…
Keith, what a great list of questions.
1. At ride height, the Mustang II suspension is designed to have the stock spindle 3-1/2″ higher than the lower arm pivot bolt center. This is the dimension used in our crossmember and tower design. Dropped spindles would be 5-1/2″ higher than the pivot bolt center and this is referenced in the instructions.2. 29-1/2″ will be fine for either the 56″ or 58″ kits.
3. The 56″ crossmember is 30″ outside the “wings”. The spring almost always clears the crossmember wings, even when they are on the outside of the frame. We used to taper the outer edge of the wings up and in towards the frame more for cosmetics than clearance. Although the 58″ crossmember is wider than the 56″ (32″ vs 30″), the upper towers mount 2″ farther apart when the 58″ crossmember is used so the clearance stays the same.
4. The geometry does change, but in the “real world” the bump steer is not noticeable. I try very hard to steer clear of discussions about this because the difference MIGHT be noticed by Tony Stewart, but not by me. Rack extensions are the correct way to go.
5. I have read about this on the internet but have no personal or business experience with this issue. I do believe the people who say they had a problem, did have the problem. I have tubular lowers on our ’40 Ford with about 50,000 miles on them over all types of roads.
Thanks very much for your questions. I hope we can help with your project.
Paul Horton
Dear Welder Series…
We are building a 1937 Studebaker 2dr president coupe. I’m helping my dad build and am talking him into the mustang front suspension. I talked to a friend of mine at air ride tech and he pointed me in your direction. We are dropping an LT1 and auto in it. Going for a comfy driver with a nice stance.
Please let me know if any of your front suspensions will work. I’m gonna get some frame dimensions measured up and I will look more into your site.
Dear Jason…
Jason, our kit is easy to fit to lots of frames. Decide what track width you want to use and if you want to use stock-style springs and shocks of coil-overs with an eye mount top and bottom. If you are looking at conventional air springs, use the kit for stock springs. If you want ShockWaves, use our coil-over kit.We also have mounts for LS series engines and they are easy to adapt to most frames.
Thanks for looking at Welder Series parts. Please get in touch again if you have other questions.
Paul Horton
Dear Welder Series…
Hey guys I have been doing a little resurch I have a 1970 f100 and I’m looking to do either a crown Vic or mustang 2 front end swap and a 4 link in the rear. Could you guys help me out a little is the mustang ii front crossmember just a weld up deal or little confused and live in Wyoming so not a whole lot of people to help me out haha
Dear Donavan…
Our MII kits are available in pieces so you can save money by welding it.A video on our website shows this being done. The instructions show how to cut notches in the crossmember and upper towers so your frame will sit at the ride height you want.
I hope this helps. Please ask other questions that you might have.
Paul Horton
Dear Welder Series…
I just got a 1939 Plymouth pickup. I want to lower it, and I’m looking at the 4 link for the rear. It has a Ford 9″ rear axle. Also looking at maybe a Mustang II front. Can you help me maybe you have something that will work. It sits way too high and I’m going to box in the frame after I’m done. Thanks, Tom.
Dear Tom…
Hi, Tom. Any one of our rear 4-link kits could be used with your Plymouth. If you use a parallel kit, be sure to get a Panhard kit, too.Check the track width (the distance from the center of one tire to the center of the opposite tire) to help decide which Mustang II kit to use. The frame width, inside and outside, will also help in choosing the Mustang II track width to get.
Here are some links for products that might work:
Rear suspensionClick on any one of the kits for a more detailed description. This will probably generate more questions. Please send them to me and I’ll try to help.
Dear Welder Series…
Hello I’m looking to put a mustang two style front suspension in a project 1966 Fairlane, what info do I need to get to you to order a close kit? Thank you
Dear Chris…
The stock track width for a 1966 Fairlane is 58″, Chris. Our 58″ Mustang II kit (shown here)refers to an approximate dimension from rotor wheel mounting face to face. The brakes and wheels you choose will alter that dimension, usually making the track width wider. I’d suggest you measure your existing tire tread center-to-center dimension using the wheels and tires you plan to run. Decide if you would like a track width slightly wider than 58″ (then order a 58″ kit) or slightly narrower (then order a 56″ kit).
Thanks for looking at Welder Series parts.
Dear Welder Series…
I have a 1952 Ford Mainline I am looking for a kit for the front end of this bad boy. I want to airbag the front at the end of the day. Do you have a kit for this. Thanks for your time Mike
Dear Mike…
Mike, putting a Mustang II in this frame requires cutting out the stock frame in the area of the upper and lower control arms and replacing that section with rectangular tubing. Then mount the MII to this tubing. There are some pic of this being done athttp://welderseries.com/?s=Mustang+II+install+pics .
Thanks for looking at Welder Series parts.
Dear Welder Series…
I have purchased your Mustang II Crossmember kit for my 1948 Ford Tudor sedan. I’m using the factory X-frame, at the front section where I am to install the crossmember there are the original frame holes. My question is do I have to box in the frame rails or can I plug weld to fill the holes? I’ve attached a picture of my frame. Where the rubber stops are located is where the holes are inside of the frame rails. The frame is already “boxed”.
The frame was upside down when taken.
Please let me know.
Thank you,
Tony
Dear Tony…
Tony, we just cut out some circles and filled the holes in the stock boxing plates.Good question.
Dear Welder Series…
Hi I’m building a custom frame I want to run a Mustang ll I like how you sell them and I plan on buying one from you my question is if running air springs and a 24 inch diameter wheel how high should the frame rails be from the ground and with 6 inches of ground clearance I want the rockers of the car to sit on the ground, like I said its custom so the frame rails can be placed anywhere. Also do you have a laser cutter or are you farming out your cuts, the reason I’m asking I have some custom shaped frame rail ideas and I like the idea of cutting and welding the shapes I want, would custom cuts be something you would be interested in doing for me? Thanks for any help and could I bother you for a catalog? I can’t see any of your products on the web site the pics are black or digital mess ..
Tom
Dear Tom…
Tom, the frame height should be mocked up once you have the wheels and tires you will use. Then our install sheets walk you through how to cut the crossmember and upper towers so the frame will be where you want it with weight on the tires.We work with a local laser cutter who understands what we are looking for in street rod products. We do custom work regularly and would be happy to quote on your drawings or sketches.
We’re working on the web store images… sorry for the inconvenience.
Dear Welder Series…
Hi there
I’m working on figuring out ride height and road clearance for my 51 Chevy if I use your MII set up and have a few questions, hoping you can assist.
1. For your MII front crossmember, what is the distance from the underside of the chevy frame to the bottom of the crossmember and what should a reasonable /safe clearance below the crossmember to the road be?
2. What is the distance from the spindle centerline to the underside of the crossmember. (assuming 2” drop spindle)
I am trying to determine from this what size wheel/tire size should be.
3. For the rear suspension, triangulated 4 link kit or individual pieces, can you please clarify the dimensions of your bars so I can figure out where they will attach to my frame?.
Your drawing indicates the lower bar should be 27-1/8 from the axle centerline but you list a 27-7/8 bar and then 23-1/8 bar and nothing in between.
Are dimensions nominally center to center on the bushings? Or center of bushing to edge of notch?
4. The upper bar should attach about 15 from the axle centerline according to your drawing so I want to see where that would end up mounting on the axle.
Can you clarify roughly what angle in plan view the upper bars are relative to the axle or roughly what length the upper bars are so I can figure out where they will sit and if that is similar to your drawing showing the bars 2-1/8 above the axle centerline?
Thanks very much for your assistance.!!
Steve
Dear Steve…
Thanks for looking at Welder Series parts for your project, Steve.I suggest you choose the tire size that you feel is best for your project, rather than work from ground clearance up. Our crossmember can be notched to accommodate the ride height you want with the tire size you choose.
I’m going to duck the ground clearance question… This depends on the roads you travel as well as possible laws in your area. NSRA has a practical suggestion with their scrub line definition. This is defined at http://www.dmv.state.pa.us/
pdotforms/pub_45/appendix.pdf . Some areas say the line should be drawn from wheel rim to wheel rim and no suspension component should below that line.With a 2″ dropped spindle, it is 7-1/4″ from spindle c/l to the bottom of our crossmember.
The dimensions on the triangulated rear 4-link installation sheets are correct. The assumption is that you know where the axle centerline is but don’t know where our axle bracket locates the urethane bushing. The bar length is from the center of the urethane bushing tube to the threaded end of the bar. The adjuster is not included in this length. Add 1-3/4″ for the large bushing adjuster. Note that the lower bar for the triangulated kit is the 23-1/8″ bar. (The 27-7/8″ bar is 7/8″ diameter and is used in our universal rear Panhard kit and the hiboy front 4-link kit.)
The frame brackets for the upper bars will likely have to be trimmed to the angle suited to your frame width and rear axle.
Thanks for these questions. I hope this info, and the install sheets online help you.
Hello, I am looking for a complete IFS front end kit for my 1937 Dodge D5 Business Coupe.
I'm looking to do a 56" wide MII on a '64 Volvo PV 544.
If I buy and install your Mustang II front crossmember for coils, what upper and lower control arms do I use?
My question is, which of your M-II kits do you suggest for this application? I can figure out the outside of hub part easy enough but do you have certain kits that are made especially for the AD GM trucks?