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Dear Welder Series…
Hi Paul I am in the middle of installing one of your triangulated four links. How much angle do I need on the upper part. (angle from frame rail to rear housing if looking from top). If I have to shorten the upper bars what would you suggest the min. Length be? Thanks
Dear Derek…
Derek, the upper bar frame bracket is designed to mount the bar at 27 degrees off of the frame. It might be hard to reduce this angle very much and still put a wrench on the nut, if the nut will even go on. Another option might be to mount the axle end of the upper bars just inside the frame rails and angle them towards the frame centerline. Then add a new crossmember and mount the frame brackets to it. This way the bars can stay at their original length. As the bars get shorter, the pinion angle changes more dramatically as the suspension works. I hope this helps.
Paul
Dear Welder Series…
I recently purchased a triangulated 4 link universal kit. I’m putting it in my 69 F100 swb. I have a couple ?s. If the horizontal angles on the upper and lower bars are the same will it have adverse effects if the sitting ride height angles are at 10 deg higher on the front? I’m thinking of raising the front frame mounts up to 10 deg so they won’t be so close to the ground. Also, is there an optimum angle for the triangle? As in looking down on it. I’m pretty close to the angle on the upper frame brackets but was wondering if any +/- is OK?
Dear Kevin…
Kevin, a 10 degree angle on the bars would put the front about 4-1/4″ higher than the rear. This would cause the rear end to “walk” as the truck leans in a corner. This “walking” will make the truck steer from the back end and could be dangerous. I’m o.k. with the front of the bar about 1″ higher than the rear. The angle of the upper bars relative to frame center line can be changed slightly. I don’t have a maximum spec to give you because we haven’t tried to see when it becomes unsafe. Thanks for these questions.
Paul Horton
Dear Welder Series…
Hi Paul I am in the middle of installing one of your triangulated four links. How much angle do I need on the upper part? (angle from frame rail to rear housing if looking from top). If I have to shorten the upper bars what would you suggest the min. length be? Thanks
Dear Derek…
Derek, the upper bar frame bracket is designed to mount the bar at 27 degrees off of the frame. It might be hard to reduce this angle very much and still put a wrench on the nut, if the nut will even go on. Another option might be to mount the axle end of the upper bars just inside the frame rails and angle them towards the frame centerline. Then add a new crossmember and mount the frame brackets to it. This way the bars can stay at their original length. As the bars get shorter, the pinion angle changes more dramatically as the suspension works.
I hope this helps.
Paul
Dear Welder Series…
I love your website. I have a 1978 trans am I am building a 4 link for. It weighs aprox 3800 lbs and around 500 hp. I’m not looking to drag race or auto cross the car, but I do have air ride shock waves. I was looking at your big bushing triangulated but all I need are the axle mounts, bars, bushings, and some upper shock mounts. I wouldn’t need the axle tabs or either frame mounts. The upper bars are around 9.25 inches eye to eye and the lower are 24.5 inches eye to eye.
Please let me know what my best option would be.
thank you Brad
Dear Welder Series…
Hi guys, just read the instructions for the rear triangle 4-link and just wondering, are the upper and lower bars supposed to end up parallel with one another? It appears that they should be by looking at your drawing but its noted stated specifically.
Thanks,
Dave
Dear Dave…
Hi, Dave. The triangulated rear 4-link bars are not parallel when viewed from the side. The front of the lower bar is about 1/2″ higher than the rear. The front of the upper bar is about 7/8″ lower than the rear. We have found that there is a fair bit of tolerance for the position of the frame mounts, but the instructions are the “best” way to install them.
Good question.
Paul Horton
Dear Welder Series…
Hi, can the WS477600 air spring brackets be substituted for the normal brackets in the WS218500 kit?
Thanks, Rob
Dear Rob…
Yes, Rob, they can.
WS218500 kit: $325.00
Less WS10768-2 axle brackets: -$70.00
Plus WS477600-2 air spring brackets: 87.20
New total: $342.20
You will need to mount the shocks and we have #223101 @ $20.00 each (2 required). They are the basic formed bracket from http://www.welderseries.com/blog/online-store/axle-bracket-kit-for-coil-overs/ . You would use standard shock studs instead of the coil-over bolts and spacers.
Our standard freight charge would be extra.
Thanks for looking at Welder Series parts.
Paul Horton
Dear Welder Series…
I want to order a triangulated 4-bar for my current project. I looked at your bug bushing series for $340.00 online. My project is a full size f-100 so I think I will be fine. Will the shock brackets accommodate a coil over after I decide what to use for suspension ? I am not sure if I am going air-ride or coil over’s yet. I need to get the 4-bar here so I can get the rear-end dimensions done and narrowed.
Please advise on kit to use and best way to ship.
Mike
Dear Mike…
The triangulated rear kit will be fine for your F100, Mike. The part number is WS318500 and, as you noted, the price is $340.00 (Canadian $). The axle brackets can be used with coil-overs or ShockWaves. If you decide to use conventional air bags, the holes in the lower axle brackets can be used to mount the shocks. We have frame and axle brackets for standard air springs. See https://www.welderseries.com/blog/online-store/air-spring-axle-bracket/ and https://www.welderseries.com/blog/online-store/air-spring-frame-bracket/ .
We ship UPS. Shipping to your door would cost Cdn$34.00. (This is about US$36.00.) Kits are in stock as I write this.
Thanks for looking at Welder Series parts.
Paul Horton
Dear Welder Series…
Thank you for the great help and parts. I have a request if possible, looking for a mounting bracket that would work for my upper 4 link bars that I bought from you it is the triangulated 4 link. I’m wanting to mount them to the top of a Chevy 10bolt rear end as you know the rear diff housing is cast. Any ideas or help would be great thanks
Dear Brian…
Brian, the upper bars can be mounted on the axle tubes just inside the frame rails. Angle the bars towards the middle of the frame and put a crossmember between the rails to hold the front brackets. All of the brackets in the kit can be used.
I hope this helps.
Paul Horton
Dear Welder Series…
Hi there, just wondering if you make a specific rear 4 link kit, set up for air bags, for a ’57 GMC long box. I’m also not sure which way to go on the triangulated or parallel scenario. if you have any input there it would be appreciated. do your kits weld brackets to the frame or bolt on? the truck will be a daily driver with a gm 5.3-4L60E for power and a rear diff from an S10 truck. not going to the track or doing burnouts all the time, just looking for an awesome smooth ride and dependability. also, would you recommend air bags or shockwave struts (for the same reason, ride and dependability). I will tow a boat with this truck on occasion. would the air bags be in front of the diff or behind the diff? if you have pics that would be great. I can weld the stuff myself, but if you could price the parts both ways and include shipping to Calgary Ab that would be great.
thanks, Dennis
Dear Dennis…
Dennis, the triangulated rear 4-link costs less than the parallel by the amount of the Panhard kit. The parallel kit with a Panhard bar is easier to adjust to center the frame left-to-right, to adjust the wheelbase, and to adjust the pinion angle. When the Panhard is installed with the bushing bolts both the same height from the ground, there is very little side-to-side movement through normal suspension travel. I have built and driven on both suspensions and couldn’t tell the difference.
We could do a rear kit (triangulated or parallel) without the coil-over bolt support blocks in the axle brackets. Those brackets could then be used as shock mounts. The air bags could be mounted from 21870 and 474208 brackets.
The ShockWaves use adjustable shocks and the whole package is easy to mount. The shocks are the key to ride quality. The air pressure will support the load.
All of our kits require welding to the frame or axle.
I like mounting the bags or ShockWaves behind the axle. I feel this gives better suspension control.
We don’t sell ShockWaves or other air bags.
Here are some part numbers and links to our web store. You can plug them into the order form (cart) to get totals for the various combinations. The store will calculate the shipping for the different groups of parts. If you send the part numbers you’d like, I can do a quote for you if you would rather not use the store.
Triangulated and parallel 4-link kits cost the same.
Triangulated 4-link (This is the “large bushing” kit. It is only $15 more than the regular kit and is much more popular.)
Parallel 4 link (Again, the large bushing kit)
Rear Panhard kit
Air spring axle bracket (2 required)
Air spring frame bracket (2 required)
The support blocks can be deducted if you use the above axle and frame brackets, but I don’t know if the store will let you put in a negative quantity. We can do it on your actual order, though.
I hope this helps you get closer to actual “garage work” making sparks.
Paul Horton
Dear Welder Series…
Hi Paul and Dorothy. Can I convert from a cross over panhard set up frame to axle housing running parallel. I want to remove it as it is too tight and banging to a triangulated set up. This is on a regular 4 link set up. Do you have a kit that would use a triangulated bar on the 4 link?
Hope you are staying well. Happy new year
Dear Gord…
Gord, here are some parts that would make the conversion from a parallel 4-link with a Panhard to a triangulated set-up:
Use the lower bars and brackets as-is.
Upper brackets (driver & pass sides): https://www.welderseries.com/blog/online-store/frame-bracket-formed/
Axle bracket kit: https://www.welderseries.com/blog/online-store/axle-bracket-kit-rear-triangulated-4-link/
Bars (2 pcs): https://www.welderseries.com/blog/online-store/bars-1-od/
Adjusters (2 pcs): https://www.welderseries.com/blog/online-store/adjuster-kits/
Urethane bushings (4 pcs): https://www.welderseries.com/blog/online-store/urethane-bushing-kits/
Hardware: We can supply all of this that’s required.
The adjusters and bars are available with the urethane bushing tube welded on or you can weld it yourself. If you will do the welding, the tubes have to be added to the list above (4 pcs): https://www.welderseries.com/blog/online-store/urethane-bushing-outer-sleeve/
The parts will cost about $200.00.
What are you working on? (I might change some of the parts once I know the vehicle.)
Happy New Year to you, too!
Paul
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